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Informed Aging
A podcast about health, help, and hard decisions for older adults.
Informed Aging
Episode 84 Hearing Clearly: The Truth About Over-the-Counter Hearing Aids
Over-the-counter hearing aids are everywhere, but are they the right solution for you or your loved ones? In this episode of Informed Aging, Robin Rountree sits down with hearing expert Jaysee Soto from Altamonte Family Hearing to break down the pros, cons, and latest advancements in hearing technology. From Apple’s AirPods Pro 2 to budget-friendly options, we discuss what works, what doesn’t, and how hearing loss impacts brain health. Listen for an informative (and fun!) discussion that might just change how you think about hearing aids.
Hearing Loss and Dementia Virtual Workshop
Click here to join the workshop on March 27th at 10:30 AM EST
Jaysee Soto of Altamonte Family Hearing
Altamonte Family Hearing on Facebook
Apple AirPods Pro 2 commercial
Robin: [00:00:00] Welcome to Informed Aging, a podcast about health help and hard decisions for older adults. I'm Robin Rountree, a former family caregiver. I've worked in the home care industry and now I work for the Alzheimer's and Dementia Resource Center. The thoughts and opinions expressed belong to me and my guest, not our wonderful employers and sponsors.
This podcast is a service of the Alzheimer's and Dementia Resource Center. We are not affiliated with the Alzheimer's Association. Before making any significant changes in your life or your person's life, please consult your own experts today. Our guest is a returning guest. It is Jaysee Soto of Altamont family Hearing.
The over the counter hearing aids are everywhere now, and we are gonna break it down with him right after this. [00:01:00] [00:02:00]
We are back with Jaysee Soto. We had you on the podcast back in November of 2022. And I remember I was like, yeah, hearing aids. How exciting is that episode gonna be? And it was so good we made it into two episodes.
Robin: Because it's incredible. And at that time, I think you told us only 20% of people who need hearing aids wear hearing aids.
Jaysee: Yeah. And that's unfortunately still about true. So it's around 28% is the latest stat that I've read of the people that have hearing loss. That get hearing aids now. There's some things that we're gonna talk about today that, that are shaking it up, and I'm excited for the future of hearing aids.
But yeah, thank you so much for having me back. This is really exciting,to be able to talk about what's new in technology. I know hearing aids may not be the most fun thing for some people to hear about, but a lot of people need it and a lot of [00:03:00] people need to know what options are out there. So thank you for having me.
Robin: Absolutely. And yeah, there are incredible options. I remember you told me, in 2022 there was a hearing aid that would. Alert if there was a fall.
Jaysee: Yeah. Yeah. Those are still
Robin: out there.
Jaysee: That's, it's still, those are still very popular. And the latest thing that is taking the hearing aid world by storm is artificial intelligence, which we're seeing AI in our phones and everything else on Google Chat, GPT, all these things.
But now it's in the hearing aid technology, which is. Been a huge leap in tech 'cause it helps people, it helps the user analyze where speech is, get rid of background noise and it just makes more decisions faster than what we've ever had. And most people that need hearing aids, their number one concern is, I can hear you, I just can't understand you, especially in that restaurant, especially in the place that it's really crowded.
So tech is just moving so, so fast. It's awesome.
Robin: , so now we have seen, at least I have seen an ad [00:04:00] for Apple. For hearing aids. Mm-hmm. And I didn't really get, like, I got the commercial. Oh, he can hear better.
But it, it didn't click until I saw you talking about it, but Apple is into the hearing aid world. Yes. How is that going? And is it cheaper? Is it better? I have all the questions that's, I did
Jaysee: it. I did it. I broke it down. I'm excited to share. First of all, if you have not seen the Apple commercial stop. Go watch it.
Come back to the podcast because, so good. It's amazing. I'm a dad of two and in the one that I saw was a dad that's not hearing his daughter. Apple did. What? Apple does, they, when it comes to marketing, they, I think they, they hit it out of the park. Yeah. Because it's pulling the emotional strings of he's hearing, he's not understanding, he's disconnected and then how much brighter it is when he does hear
Robin: goosebumps right now just remembering it.
Yeah. I know.
Jaysee: they did such a good job. So AirPods, they can't amplify. So now AirPods have had, and a lot of other. [00:05:00] Wearables , not necessarily hearing aids have had active noise canceling and also a form of live listen. Meaning hearing your surrounding. What they did with AirPods Pro two now said they have tech that you can take a hearing screening and it's gonna amplify based on that screening, what it thinks you need.
So they're now able to give amplification and , it's $250, so it's extremely affordable. Wow. And it's not a separate device, so it is. The same AirPods that you would buy at Best Buy. It's not like I'm buying a hearing aid. You're buying the AirPods Pro two
Robin: that you see everybody else just wearing around.
Yeah.
Jaysee: Yeah.
Robin: That is crazy.
Jaysee: There's, it's a little bittersweet for us in the world of audiology. One, the exciting part is people are talking about it, the commercial is impactful, and people are starting to say, Hey, dad, mom, mom, dad, what about this? Let's look at this. Let's start here. That barrier.
Removing the barrier of cost and just going in and having a hearing evaluation appointment, that's an intimidating appointment. [00:06:00] That's a milestone for some people. So being able to say, I bought these on Amazon, or Best Buy, try these. Tell me what you think is impactful. I. Where there's a few shortcomings and we've had patients come in with them and we do something in the office called Real ear measurement, which is when someone has a hearing loss, we can see are the hearing aids filling that prescriptive target?
Are they getting what they need? In the AirPods Pro two, in the examples that I've had in the office, they don't fit the script. There is gain, there is power, so the person's gonna put 'em on and go, Ooh, I can hear better. Just like I'm hearing like through these headphones and I'm hearing amplification.
They're gonna put them on and go, I am hearing amplified. And that could be good subjectively to the patient, to the person. Now patient, this person is just a consumer, but that does not necessarily mean that their prescription's being met. And that's the gray area. that's where I think it's almost like training wheels.
Okay. Or hearing aids. But $250,I can't stress [00:07:00] that part of, enough because it's what people have been asking for and a brand. That people recognize and they know that and they trust for the most part. So kudos to Apple for breaking into that. Samsung hasn't Bose for, they've done so and they did it for a minute.
Right? Over the counter. Yeah. No, yeah. But the way Samsung's putting it in their keynote, talking about it in their ads, like it's. It's great. It's starting a conversation, so we're really excited for the future.
Robin: It's to me, for an analogy, people buying the readers for a dollar at the Dollar Tree just to help out, but it's oh, honey, yeah, you're gonna need more than that, but at least it's a start.
Jaysee: yes, exactly. At some point they're gonna go, all right, lemme go get my vision tested. And there's some of that and. The most important thing when someone gets the actual prescription hearing aids is we can make sure that the script is being met. You can adjust like the patient, the person can pull up their smartphone, make some tweaks and say, [00:08:00] turn this up, turn this down.
And they're gonna do what's best for them subjectively. But what you pay for when you go to someone like, like us in our practice, is for that person to ensure that it's doing what it's supposed to. So there's that peace of mind element. Some people, another thing that I'm like excited about is. There are people that don't have access to care.
There's people that might have, here we're in central Florida, there's a hearing aid office in every corner, right? Because we do have a lot of seniors that do move down to Florida, as you guys may know. But the there may be somewhere in the Midwest that it's over an hour to get to a provider.
There may be people in another country that don't have access to hearing healthcare. How amazing would it be to take a $250 AirPod to Grandma and Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico, Venezuela. Places that there isn't access to care and say, Hey, you can at least hear me a little better now. so there's tho that's the other side.
If you have access to care, I would always, I. Push, make sure that you are doing what's in your best health interest. And that is only through a hearing care provider. But for those that don't have that, [00:09:00] wow, they can hear, you don't have to be isolated. You don't have to miss out, on what's happening.
and just sit back and with family, a lot of times there's a lot of.we're not gonna talk to so and so 'cause he can't hear you anyway. Yeah. And all these things that happen and that just goes down the road of isolation. Why $250? that's, I'm excited about that. As you can see.
Robin: and I know somebody listening is going $250 sounds like a lot, but
Jaysee: in comparison, yes.
In
Robin: comparison to $4,000. Exactly. Now you can see the excitement. It is. Relatively cheaper, but I will say I did come and have a hearing evaluation with you. And it is not just is this louder or less loud? it's a science. And you've got these graphs that come out, so you may be able to hear like notes.
I guess very well in the high range, but then the low range, if somebody was talking really low, I may have more problem hearing that. And that changes for each individual, right?
Jaysee: Every single [00:10:00] audiogram, every single prescription is different. Most people with the aging process, it's called presbycusis, what they would lose is their high mid to higher frequencies first.
So that's where I need more treble, let's say in music. That's, I hear you, but I didn't understand you. I missing some of my consonants. Those are the things that we dial in to make sure, wait, hold on. Those contents were missed. let's bring them back. Let's give them to them with a hearing aid. and those are the areas that you're just not gonna reach that level with any over the counter, not just AirPods, unless the loss is very mild.
So with outside of AirPods, all of the things that we're seeing online, 'cause there's a ton of ads since this was. Push, I think it was 2019 that the FDA authorized over the counter, and we've been seeing the increase since there's so many companies out there that, that advertise for 200, $300 as over the counter.
Like why spend the 4,000, 5,000? And some of these ads are very smart. The marketing is, they know, right? They know to push the [00:11:00] buttons. if a senior has been, or if a person, let's say not even a senior, if a person has been to have a hearing evaluation. And they got quoted 4,000 and there's an ad that said, why spend 4,000 spend these 200?
it's very tempting. So since then, there's a lot of companies that have come out that's where it's a little trickier, because they're, the quality's not the same. there's a lot of Chinese amplifiers, that you see. We get, I get contacted all the time on LinkedIn of oh, sell our product and.
I if a person's gonna go down the road of an over the counter versus getting a prescription hearing aid, I would still look for that brand recognition. 'cause like a Sony, a Bose, in this case Apple, these guys are at least spending some money on some research and development, making sure that you're getting a quality product.
But there's a lot, and we see it all the time, just people that fall for like the TV ads and the newspaper ads and just be careful with that one. that's what we're afraid of. 'cause then you end up.throwing the money away and then ultimately coming into an office and going. I'm ready for the real thing.[00:12:00]
Robin: Right. The reason that I brought you back here, um, was Consumer Reports actually had an article about over the counter hearing aids. I'm like, oh, it has gone prime time now if Consumer Reports is getting into it. And they said they were gonna do their ranking, but they said, because hearing loss can be so varied among individuals.
It's hard to say which will be best for you. So they didn't rank hearing aids, they just told you the pros and the cons. So if you get a hearing aid that isn't working for you over the counter, you may or may not know this, can you return it?
Jaysee: Yes. Some
Robin: some
Jaysee: I believe so. Actually, hold on.
What is a Florida law on that? I've seen that you can return on most of them, but I don't know if that is the law. I can say for prescription devices in Florida, there is a law that protects the consumer. They do have a right to return them, I would assume the answer is yes. I wish I knew definitively right now, but let's say they do give you a 45 day risk-free trial.
the thing with consumer Reports is [00:13:00] there's so many of these brands that are out there, right? They, it's very difficult to say, it's not a one size fits all. Like, hey, the Sennheiser is gonna fit just about everyone. The key thing that I saw in their publication is making sure that it's between mild to moderate hearing loss.
And most people don't know what that means. And that's the other, you know, it's a little confusing if someone reads that because we have people that come into the office for a hearing test, they go, ah, I got a little bit of hearing loss. And the family's no, he needs real. dad, dad needs a lot of help.
And then when we test them, they could have a mild hearing loss in their lows and severe in their highs. But the person, what they feel their subjective experience is. Yeah. I've maybe missed a little. I believe that the FDA should have required an audiogram before. And there was a lot of lobbying and back and forth, and we have a little bit of that's happening right now that I'll share, a little later, but.
The, I wish that the person couldn't have some sort of certification, some sort of audiogram that says you do qualify [00:14:00] for over the counter. You are, your hearing loss is so minimal that you know, if it's a mild loss, that you can get away with this a thousand dollars product versus this $4,000 product. so it's very difficult for them or for any publication to say this is the one that fits you.
'cause we don't know what do you need? And that's the gray area. And even if someone does the screening, they don't. They don't, you could do a lot of homework and figure it out, but they don't really know what that means.
Robin: Okay. So a another thing that I learned from you was the shape of my ear canal was a little wonky, and you were like, do you have problem like with in ear headphones?
And I'm like. Yeah. So you don't know that you could be buying these over and over again and you just don't have the ear canal for them.
Jaysee: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And custom. In prescription devices, you can have custom molds made, or there's pediatric sizes, there's little tips that would fit the tiny canal.
Some people have difficulty, like even with something like the AirPods, that's really, I mean, they have buds for like almost every size, and there's people that'll go none of these really feel good [00:15:00] for me. So yeah. That's gonna be, you know, if we have a tricky ear like that. And how would you know? But, if you've had difficulty with a lot of these earbuds and you're on this fence of, should I go over the counter?
Should I go direct? If that's in your history, I'd probably at least have the hearing evaluation, have that person look and see what they suggest. And some of them, so another tricky thing is people think that they can get the over the counter that's really tiny, that goes in the canal, that no one sees.
That is a very discreet hearing aid, but what's actually going in your canal is larger than the behind the ear style. They have just a little dome, so the most common type of prescription hearing aid is a behind the ear and over the counter. They do have that style too.
Robin: Oh,
Jaysee: okay. It's, that is, I'd say the safest one if you're shopping, because most of the components are outside of your ear, so if you have a small canal.
It's easier to put the little dome in. This is hard to give you a visual without right over here. But this is where looking, take a picture of your [00:16:00] ear, see what the product is, and see what's gonna fit inside.
Robin: Okay. Alright. That makes sense. and you were speaking about getting an audiogram, I think I saw at one time they may still do it.
A a RP was offering a free hearing test over the telephone. Is that Yeah. I didn't even
Jaysee: know. Wow. Yeah. How, how? How? I don't know. So, um, don't do that. Don't do that. Okay. That is okay. That's, I will, that my professional recommendation is there is no way in the world that, that is, that they can calibrate equipment on your phone.
That the speaker's large enough that the seal is good enough. no, I don't know. Alright. So I will say A A RP though does, since, just since we've mentioned them, right? They do have discounts, in their plans for some hearing aids. And most practices, I'll say at least in, in our area in central Florida, they'll do a, a complimentary screening, at least to see like where you are.
And some will charge for a thorough evaluation, some won't. Do that. So do that. 'cause then you're gonna find out what You're really over the phone. Over
Robin: the phone. Not,
Jaysee: no.
Robin: it might be [00:17:00] like, okay, we've rung this thing three times and you didn't hit zero. You may have an issue, but that would be like the same thing your wife could tell you.
Yeah. You can't hear anything.
Jaysee: Or it may Yeah, maybe like a pass fail. Maybe. Maybe it's a screening of some, but it would not be, yeah, there's, it wouldn't be enough to even. To even look at, am I an over the counter candidate? that would be a very loose pass, fail sort of screening. some apps though do have where you can put on headphones and if you are in a very, very quiet setting, I'd say that's pretty accurate.
Actually, the AirPods were one of them. we had a patient come in. He was in quiet in a quiet room with the AirPods. He did his screening and we compared it to our professional audiogram and it was very close. Wow. But the AirPods do seal the ears and they're blocking noise. So it is very dampening, which is awesome.
that's what we want. And it was really close. So I'm. If it's with headphones, I'd say it's at least enough to get an idea over the phone. I still don't know how that one would work, so no.
Robin: Okay. Okay. [00:18:00] Yeah. So the AirPods Are going in your ear. Now, does that block the sound of somebody walking up behind you?
Because if you're listening to music, you can be startled.
Jaysee: Yeah.
Robin: But if you're using it as a hearing aid, is that problem still there?
Jaysee: no. If you're using it as a hearing aid, their open microphone feature means that you're gonna, you should. Have awareness still. Okay. Because the you, so most hearing aids, or even for the over the counter, let's say Sennheiser or Bose, they're gonna be in some sort of omnidirectional meaning hearing all around me mode unless you've told it.
And if they have the mode to say, focus just in front of me, the AirPods, because they're designed blocks your whole canal. I'm sure their microphones would keep it open like you shouldn't be startled. Okay. unless it doesn't have enough power for you and you did not hear those footsteps, which would come back to, we should not have had those in the first place there.
But if the person does have a very mild loss, they might be able to get away with.you shouldn't feel afraid of them. I am gonna hear if someone snuck up on me. [00:19:00]
Robin: Okay. So if you were shopping for over the counter hearing aids, there are some that are just going to amplify, correct? Mm-hmm. There are some that are gonna have an app to help you figure out more specifically?
Yes. Is that, would the AirPod be one of those that help you? Yes. Okay. So
Jaysee: the AirPod has an app, Sony, I think. so a lot of the hearing aid manufacturers. split and made a, let's say, a value over the counter version. Sony is one of them. Sony is a partnered with a company named Signia, which is a prescription, a leading German engineering, one of the top manufacturers in the world.
They made this and it's very close on how their app looks. Very user-friendly. Bose also did the same thing, and who's the other one? Oh, and Sennheiser. Sennheiser. So those three names are some of the big ones. There's a Lexi two. Which is Bose also. It's a little confusing, but that's another one that has an app that you can make adjustments definitely up for those.
Those are pricey though. So those are the, just about all the ones that I named are in the a thousand dollars [00:20:00] ish, eight to 1200. Okay. Other price range. And you can see them at Best Buy online. they're also publications like Consumer Reports. They're gonna be very excited to talk about over the counter hearing aids because.
They can also sell them. I dunno if Consumer Reports does, but if they do, there is a financial interest in there. Ah. if so, we can, how do I put this? Altamonte family hearing my practice, we can sell over the counter hearing aids as well and there is a profit and that, and as a business owner, I choose not to because I believe that the only way to properly fit a device is a prescription device because it's the only one that I can.
Make tweaks and adjust to. So I always have a hidden little, is there a bias here? of course here I'm advocating for better hearing healthcare, whether it's in my office or somebody else's, no matter where you're listening to this, but, and you might think, of course he's gonna say, go to his office and do that.
But I do want to be clear that every hearing care provider can purchase over the counter hearing aids and sell them for a profit as a [00:21:00] business would. But because we cannot adjust them, you're re, you're really not gonna get the service end of it. And it becomes of, it becomes a question of, am I gonna do this just to make a buck?
And is that right? I don't, so for us, it, for me, it doesn't make sense. It goes against our values in the profession. But an online store might, a, hear.com or something like that. They might sell it and ship it to you because it's a profit. And now if that publication's saying these are the best.
'cause they can sell 'em. Then it becomes a little bit of a, is this genuine or not?
Robin: Okay. Alright. if you can't afford the $4,000, if that just is out of the question, then you say yes rather than nothing at all. That $250 range or $500 or a thousand, whatever fits your price range, that's better than nothing.
Jaysee: Yes. Okay. yes. I want. Yeah, if a person has a need, it is something is just about always better than nothing. There's no way that having [00:22:00] some gain, unless it's just really not enough, unless their hearing loss is so poor, which then it would just, it would not be a consideration if you are B, if you have more than 40 decibels of a hearing loss on an audiogram, which is where we score the test.
If you've had a test, or even if you've done the screening, if you see the number 40, if you're there and below. Then I would not waste the money there. 'cause yes, you're gonna get some power, but you're, it's not, it truly isn't enough. And it is very sooner than later, you're gonna come in and have a hearing evaluation with a professional.
If you are above that and 4,000 and there's other price ranges, right? Let's say 4,000 is an average, and 4,000 is out of the question, then yes. But before, before you do that, do check out your health insurance so many. Plans are now having discounted hearing aids, actual prescription hearing aids that are more competitive than those.
So like in, in my practice, we have outside of insurance. We have a value, hearing aid that is $2,800 and it's a leading manufacturer with a [00:23:00] three-year warranty, with service, with testing, with these things. That is still a lot of money. I'm not saying it isn't, but some of these plans will have, like I, let's say UnitedHealthcare to say an example.
They can have a hearing aid for around, let's say $1,200 also, but they're actual prescription device. You're gonna get the benefit of being tested. Getting fit? Is it the best hearing aid? No. Does it have the AI and all the fun things we're excited about? No. But objectively it does what the person needs and that's not only gonna help them hear, but it helps their brain.
It helps them be in, listening with all their senses as much as they can. So it's gonna keep them in the picture versus, oh, this is a little louder, but I'm still not understanding.
Robin: Awesome. And speaking of, we really want our ears to work. We want to be able to hear because of the brain, you are doing a workshop with us.
hearing loss and dementia coming up Thursday, March 27th. Now it is going to be virtual, so I will post the link. All you have to do is click on it at, Thursday, March 27th [00:24:00] at. 10:30 AM Eastern and you can watch the workshop with you and Alexandra, and you are gonna talk about that link between hearing loss and dementia, how to care for your ears.
I'm thinking the Q-tip all the way in is gonna be a
Jaysee: no.
Robin: Don't do that. Okay. So
Jaysee: the nothing smaller than your elbow that you guys have heard. Nothing. Nothing goes in. No, nothing goes in. We put things in the ears. No Q-tips, no bobby pins. No. I've heard some fun stories.
Robin: no, don't do that.
Protect those ears. Don't do that. Yeah. So that again, is March 27th from 10 30 till noon. Eastern time. And we will have the link in the show notes. Jaysee, you are amazing and let me say. You are fascinating on social media. I usually see you on LinkedIn, but on TikTok
Jaysee: And Instagram, what's your handle?
Thank you. Thank you. I am the bald hearing guy, so if you guys are on TikTok, Instagram, our YouTube channel as well. Bald Hearing guy. I'm having a lot of fun. I'm trying to make all of this that it can be overwhelming and it's a lot to, to digest. I'm trying to make it fun [00:25:00] and I err on the side of a little bit more casual and, I'm having a good time.
So thank you. Thank you. Thank you for seeing that and letting me know that you're seeing it.
Robin: Yeah. Yeah. He will, walk out in the middle of a rainstorm to check if his hearing aids are waterproof.
Jaysee: There are waterproof hearing aids, so yes, and I've tested them. I've battle tested them. So there was, yeah, there was one day that it was pouring outside and they just came out and I just had 'em in my office and we had a cancellation.
And I was like, you know what? It was completely unscripted. There was no, I said, follow me with the camera and, hilarious video. Follow me on, TikTok, wherever you guys Yes. See your social media. You'll see the video, please. and your
Robin: tag is again the bald Yes, bald hearing guy. The bald hearing guy.
Bald hearing guy. There we go. Great. Please make sure to subscribe to our podcast Informed Aging and tell your family and friends about us if you'd like to support the work that we do at the Alzheimer's and Dementia Resource Center. Go to adrc cares.org/donate. You can find us on Facebook and Instagram Informed [00:26:00] Aging.
And today's episode was recorded at ADRC's podcast Studio. That's it for now. We're looking forward to our next visit.