Episode 114: The Truth About LGBTQ+ Aging

The Center Orlando
thecenterorlando.org
LGBTQ+ community center offering senior programs, mental health services, and connection opportunities for all ages.

Age Forward (Pride Chamber Orlando)
Part of the Pride Chamber, building an affirming, educated network of professionals serving LGBTQ+ older adults.

National LGBTQ+ Chamber (NGLCC)
nglcc.org
Find LGBTQ+ Chambers of Commerce and inclusive businesses nationwide.

SAGE (Services & Advocacy for LGBTQ+ Elders)
sageusa.org
National organization providing advocacy, resources, and training for LGBTQ+ older adults.

CenterLink
lgbtcenters.org
Directory of LGBTQ+ community centers across the U.S.

211 Helpline (United Way)
Dial 211
Connects you to local health, housing, and support services.

Support the Alzheimer's & Dementia Resource Center 

Transcript

[00:00:00] . Welcome to Informed Aging, a podcast about health, help, and hard decisions for older adults. I'm Robyn Rountree. I'm a former family caregiver. I've worked in the home care industry, and now work for the Alzheimer's and Dementia Resource Center. The thoughts and opinions on this podcast belong to me and my guests, not our wonderful employers and sponsors.

[00:00:27] Before making any significant changes in your life or your person's life, please consult your own experts. Today, we're talking about a group of older adults, and aging for them is a little bit different. It was something I didn't know about, and I needed to learn more. It's aging in the LGTBQ+ population. We'll get into it right after this

[00:01:08] 

[00:01:56] Robin Rountree: We are back and talking about one of those things that you don't realize you don't know, 'cause you don't know.

[00:02:03] but then it was brought to my attention, and I wanted to share it with everyone, and it's aging as LGTBQ. And you feel free to correct any things that I'm saying incorrectly. You can also- You said it perfectly. Okay, good. Good. So I guess when you just don't know anything, you think, you don't think there would be a problem there, but there is.

[00:02:25] So to explain everything to me and to us, I've got George Wallace here. He's the chief executive officer with The Center Orlando. Yes. And also a return guest, Tee Rogers, is back, talking about something different than funeral planning. she is also with the Pride Chamber and the director of the Age Forward program.

[00:02:47] So we're gonna start with George. Tell me about The Center Orlando. 

[00:02:52] George Wallace: So The Center Orlando has been here since 1978, and we have a senior program called OWLs, Older Wiser Learners. Ooh. We also have HIV testing, health services, mental health counseling, youth programming, and anything and everything you can think of.

[00:03:09] We're a community center, and we're here to serve the entire population of Central Florida. 

[00:03:13] Robin Rountree: That's amazing. So aging is, I've been doing this podcast for four years. 

[00:03:18] It's hard for anybody. 

[00:03:20] George Wallace: Yeah. 

[00:03:21] Robin Rountree: But there are some extra challenges with being LGTBQ, so talk me through them because I think to somebody, of course, we all get caught up in our own little worlds.

[00:03:31] We don't think about how that would be for somebody so tell me about some of those differences. 

[00:03:35] George Wallace: Sure. actually, I do a positive affirmation or quote every morning on my social media- Oh ... and today was Dan Savage, who is a podcaster, but the quote was, "It gets better." And I think that is so true, and it was for our youth, but I also think it is really pertinent to our seniors.

[00:03:52] It does get better because so many people have to go back into the closet, and healthcare is different, and they have a higher level of isolation. So I always say it gets better, and there are services and programs like The Center, and there's a national LGBTQ, senior program called SAGE, that we're not a member of, but we can get resources from.

[00:04:13] Robin Rountree: Nice. 

[00:04:13] George Wallace: And, I just, I would say it gets better because, education is key and continuing to talk about some of the disparities that our senior youth. Our youth- ... our seniors, face. 

[00:04:25] Robin Rountree: Okay. You said go back in the closet. What do you mean by that? 

[00:04:28] George Wallace: So oftentimes a lot of people, they're afraid to disclose to their primary care that they are- maybe a lesbian or gay.

[00:04:37] definitely transgender. And then also, sometimes, they had such bad experiences with family and being disowned, so they, a lot of times when they go to look at housing, they don't... they lose their identity and their authentic self. 

[00:04:53] and I hear and see that more often than I would like to.

[00:04:56] And going back to my quote, it gets better, I think that as, society changes, in 10, 20 years it's gonna look different. Our population now tends to skew a little bit older, so most of them don't have children, and the next generation of our seniors that we'll be serving probably do have children.

[00:05:15] it- it's gonna look different in a few years, but right now it's a tough spot. 

[00:05:19] Robin Rountree: Yeah. finding a good primary is hard just for anybody. Yeah. But if you're worried about being rejected or not getting the best care because of who you are- 

[00:05:30] George Wallace: Yeah ... 

[00:05:30] Robin Rountree: that sucks. 

[00:05:31] George Wallace: It's a lot of trauma that our older population has faced.

[00:05:35] they come from pre-Stonewall. 

[00:05:37] Robin Rountree: Yeah. 

[00:05:37] George Wallace: And, a lot of times isolation and hiding who you are, We still have some of our seniors that are... They're just so lovely. some of them have met at our program, and- ... they've been married, which they never thought they would ever be able to do.

[00:05:51] and then there are other people that are in our program that are in their late 80s, and they still call their significant other their friend. Ah. because it's ingrained in them. 

[00:05:59] yeah. 

[00:05:59] Robin Rountree: we have had some progress, but- 

[00:06:01] George Wallace: We have ... 

[00:06:02] Robin Rountree: we could take a few more steps. 

[00:06:03] George Wallace: We sure could.

[00:06:04] Robin Rountree: Or a couple miles. 

[00:06:05] George Wallace: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. 

[00:06:06] Robin Rountree: Okay. So you're talking about not having children, our current population. I can identify. I don't have kids myself. And it does pose a possible problem Many people say to me, it really doesn't matter if you have a kid or not, it does not guarantee having somebody to take care of you.

[00:06:25] George Wallace: Sure. 

[00:06:25] Robin Rountree: But if you don't have any kids at all, then how do you find the support you typically would get from your children? 

[00:06:32] George Wallace: So I think programs like the center, and there are other programs throughout Central Florida, companions and oftentime people will lean into those types of social services and programs because, they're available, and that's really what I tell people, find your tribe.

[00:06:50] and also there's chosen family. Just because you don't have a family, you can still have a chosen family, and a lot of times people will have chosen family and their friends become family. 

[00:07:02] Robin Rountree: That's incredible. When I was flipping through the statistics, one thing that stood out to me is because of the discrimination in earlier decades, oftentimes the LGTBQ community wasn't getting the best jobs, all right?

[00:07:16] Or they were discriminated against. So they were not making the ton of money that they could have, and so now their Social Security is smaller. And that had not- popped into my head that, okay, somebody could say, "Oh, you're fine now. You don't have that discrimination," but that doesn't add up for all of those decades where they were earners and they were being discriminated against.

[00:07:40] George Wallace: Sure. Sure, definitely, and that's where I was talking about, previous trauma. and a lot of times people hid who they were so that they could live and take care of themselves, and a lot of times, that meant that if you took a job, that you couldn't be out. I remember reading stories, um, I'm, I'm actually old enough this year to join our senior group, 'cause it's for those over 55, but I, I remember reading stories of people who just could not be their authentic self, and they had to- Mm

[00:08:10] lie, and it was oftentimes, um, school teachers. If you found out that you were gay, you could be fired. You know, so and then, you could not be a police officer- Mm-hmm ... you know, heaven forbid. And male nurses were just not common, because if you were a nurse and a male, you were probably queer, right?

[00:08:30] Mm-hmm. So, um, a lot of times people just did not... They, they had a passion, but they didn't move forward with those passions because it may identify them as being gay. You didn't see men fashion designers- Right ... back in the '30s, '40s, '50s, '60s. So, you know, we've made a lot of progress. 

[00:08:47] Robin Rountree: Right. Yeah. But there's still a lot to heal.

[00:08:50] George Wallace: Still a lot. Still a lot, yeah. 

[00:08:52] Robin Rountree: All right. Well, as a podcast, we are both in Central Florida and worldwide. Oh, wow. So... Yeah, I know. So if somebody's not in Central Florida, how would you advise them to find their tribe? 

[00:09:06] George Wallace: So, um, online, right? Like a lot of times online, do research. And here in the States we have the United Way, and there's a 211.

[00:09:16] Ah. So you can always call 211. It's nationwide here. Um, and I'm sure there's similar programs in Canada and, and other parts of the world. And reach out and ask where those resources are if you don't have the capacity or ability or knowledge to get online, 'cause sometimes, you know, technology is not, is not everyone's friend.

[00:09:35] Robin Rountree: Right. 

[00:09:36] George Wallace: Right.

[00:09:36] And then there's, you know, um, faith and churches and those types of programs and, and social gatherings. And I know here in Orlando we have senior centers that are- Yes

[00:09:47] specifically for older adults. Ours is a community center, and the OWL is a program of the center. So, um, you know, you can see, I always say you can see any walk of life in the center. The youngest person we serve is five. Oh. And the oldest we serve is 93. 

[00:10:04] Robin Rountree: Yeah, that's a, that's a broad spectrum.

[00:10:06] George Wallace: Pretty broad, right? Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:10:07] Robin Rountree: Right. 

[00:10:08] George Wallace: Yeah. 

[00:10:08] Robin Rountree: So you say it's a community center. Anybody from the community can walk in? 

[00:10:12] George Wallace: Sure can. 

[00:10:13] Robin Rountree: Okay. Yeah. I like that. Yeah. I like that. And where is the center in Orlando? 

[00:10:16] George Wallace: Um, it's on Mills Avenue, right in the Mills 50, right in the heart. We've been there since 1999. 

[00:10:21] Robin Rountree: All right.

[00:10:22] Yeah. That's amazing. So let's bring in Tee, And, um, how are we improving things? Let's say I need to find a doctor who is LGTBQ educated and friendly, I guess would be the word. Is there a database right now for that? 

[00:10:41] Tee Rogers: There is not a database for that. Hmm. Um, but, you know, locally, we are establishing the Age Forward program that you mentioned before, and that is to bring together professionals who serve LGBTQ+ older adults so that we can create that affirming network for referral partners, so that we know when we're providing referrals to older LGBTQ+ adults that they're not just affirming, but they're identity educated and understand the challenges that are being faced.

[00:11:13] We also want to, amplify and create greater access to resources like SAGE, which George mentioned, and make sure that people who want to be affirming and need that competency training are able to access that. 

[00:11:28] Robin Rountree: Yeah, because if you, you just assume, "Oh, I don't have a problem with that," but not having a problem with it is not the same as understanding the specific needs.

[00:11:36] Tee Rogers: Correct. 

[00:11:37] Robin Rountree: Okay, and you are gonna be offering those services through the Age Forward program? 

[00:11:42] Tee Rogers: Yeah, so the Pride Chamber of Commerce is for LGBTQ+ and ally-owned businesses and professionals. So we bring together those professionals for networking, and there are multiple programs within the Pride Chamber.

[00:11:56] This one specifically will be for professionals who serve older adults, so we'll be bringing people together to create that network and, um, have educational events and activities. 

[00:12:07] Robin Rountree: Professionals who serve older adults is a very wide... That's everybody from your- your plumber to your geriatrician. 

[00:12:15] Tee Rogers: Yeah. So when we think of people who serve older adults, we have a, a picture in our mind of who that might be, like home healthcare and hospice workers and death care professionals like myself.

[00:12:26] Yeah. But when we had our soft opening for Age Forward, we had some people there who were tiny home builders- Oh ... and explained to us how their work intersects with serving LGBTQ+ old- elder people. So I think we don't wanna put a frame on that. We want people to define for themselves whether this program is gonna be something that benefits them as professionals.

[00:12:49] Robin Rountree: Yeah, even just something like a car mechanic. Yep. Um, if I saw that they were in, in the Age Forward program, I would be more likely to go like, "Okay, if they're doing the extra effort to learn about this population, they're probably gonna treat me as a human being as well instead of- Yes ... like thinking I don't know anything about cars," which I know about two things, but that's not nothing.

[00:13:14] So how do people get involved with Age Forward? 

[00:13:18] Tee Rogers: This is a program of our local Pride Chamber, and- Oh, okay ... um, there are other similar programs, maybe not through Pride Chambers- Right ... um, but there are other programs around the nation that we see. We are hoping that other LGBTQ+ chambers around the nation will pick this up and take this as a model for something that they can do in their local communities as well.

[00:13:41] Robin Rountree: Okay. So Pride Chamber, that's here in Orlando, but there are other LGTBQ chambers out there. Absolutely. So that would be another place to search to find your tribe, possibly. 

[00:13:52] George Wallace: Yeah. 

[00:13:52] Robin Rountree: Okay. And so you could also search the chamber in other places. Possibly you would find LGTBQ-friendly businesses probably are a part of that chamber.

[00:14:03] Tee Rogers: Yep. 

[00:14:03] Robin Rountree: All right, but you're taking the extra initiative and training people. 

[00:14:08] Tee Rogers: Correct. So just because someone's signed up to be a member of the chamber doesn't necessarily mean they've developed competencies for working with older LGBTQ+ adults. 

[00:14:17] Robin Rountree: Gotcha. 

[00:14:18] Tee Rogers: So it's, it is that extra layer of commitment and making sure that we're providing the best service to the people in front of us.

[00:14:25] Robin Rountree: Okay. George and Tee, this question's for both of you, and we'll start with George. Sure. Um, what's something that you think most people would need to know about this population that we don't know already? 

[00:14:38] George Wallace: So dignity and, and- Mm ... we're just, we're humans, and we just wanna be treated with dignity and respect.

[00:14:44] And a lot of times, you know, sexual orientation should be an afterthought. Just serve people because they're human beings, and it doesn't matter if they're gay or straight, trans, Black, white. It doesn't matter. We're, we're all humans at the end of the day. 

[00:14:59] Robin Rountree: Amen to that. Tee? 

[00:15:01] Tee Rogers: Well, I'm gonna take that from the perspective of the professionals- Mm-hmm

[00:15:05] and say that there are a lot of professionals serving older LGBTQ+ adults out there who really want to be affirming and, you know, really want to have that identity education but maybe don't know where to start. So making sure that they are aware of resources like Age Forward, like Sage Care, and trainings that are out there is really important.

[00:15:26] Robin Rountree: Yeah. Tee spoke, a few months ago, and you handed out a quiz. And what would you say the topic of that quiz was? 

[00:15:36] Tee Rogers: It was just general information about LGBTQ+ aging. 

[00:15:40] Robin Rountree: Yeah. And I, this is- A 

[00:15:41] Tee Rogers: lot of what George talked about earlier. 

[00:15:43] Robin Rountree: Yeah. And I did not know a lot of it, and I was like, "Oh, I do have some things to learn."

[00:15:47] So I'm so glad you are doing this program. Um, in other parts of the world that are listening, would you encourage similar programs? 

[00:15:57] George Wallace: Oh, definitely. And, you know SAGE is a national program here in, in the States and Canada. But there are about 300 LGBT centers across the United States. 

[00:16:08] Robin Rountree: Nice. 

[00:16:09] George Wallace: So we're, we're a network.

[00:16:10] We're all independent. Um, but many of them have senior programs, very robust senior programs that I'm a little envious of. Mm. Um, because they have the capacity and space to do it, right? Um, in Fort Lauderdale, they actually have housing. In Los Angeles- Wow ... they actually have senior housing that is attached to the center itself so that there, there's 24-hour support and resources.

[00:16:35] And, um, isolation is something that- Mm ... seniors face, and, and especially queer seniors, a, a level of isolation. So in our program, we actually do weekly phone calls. We do check-ins. Oh. So... And it... We have a weekly program, but if they don't come for a few weeks, you wanna check in on them. And I'll never forget calling someone and, um, they said, "Oh, you know what?

[00:16:59] I don't live in Orlando anymore." And I was like, "Well, I'm gonna stop calling you," and they said, "Please don't." 

[00:17:04] Robin Rountree: Aw. "

[00:17:04] George Wallace: You're the only connection I'm getting, because I moved with my family and I'm living in Montana." 

[00:17:10] Robin Rountree: Mm. "

[00:17:11] George Wallace: And I thought I was isolated in Orlando, but it's much worse now because I don't have a program, and I'm not getting out of the house."

[00:17:19] So basically, every week I was the only person that was talking with them. 

[00:17:23] Robin Rountree: Wow. 

[00:17:24] George Wallace: So these, these programs serve a purpose. 

[00:17:27] Robin Rountree: Yeah. Oh. 

[00:17:29] George Wallace: You know? And it's, sometimes it's something as small as a phone call. 

[00:17:32] Robin Rountree: Yeah. 

[00:17:33] George Wallace: Right? 

[00:17:33] Robin Rountree: Yeah. But that isolation is so dangerous to our health. 

[00:17:37] George Wallace: It is. 

[00:17:38] Robin Rountree: Um, COVID- Yeah ... really drove that point home.

[00:17:41] George Wallace: Yeah. 

[00:17:41] Robin Rountree: So I would say that's one thing to think about. Um, also while you're talking about that, I'm thinking as you're shopping for maybe you need assisted living right now. 

[00:17:52] George Wallace: Mm-hmm. 

[00:17:53] Robin Rountree: How do you know that's gonna be a friendly environment, you know? Right. And that's not on the brochure probably. 

[00:17:59] George Wallace: Mm. Right. Well, you know, sometimes they are.

[00:18:01] Oh. There's actually, there's an assisted living and nursing home that actually has, um, a rainbow flag and it says safe space on their literature. 

[00:18:09] Robin Rountree: Oh. 

[00:18:10] George Wallace: Um, we actually have a resource guide and we vet them, so we will only refer to lawyers and doctors and, and places that we know that have anti-discrimination policies.

[00:18:21] And not all places do, because in 21 states here, you can discriminate based on sexual orientation, and that includes housing. And Flor- Really? Correct. 21 states do not have legal protection for LGBTQ citizens, and Florida is one of them. So you can be fired for identifying as gay. You can be denied housing or public accommodations for simply being who you are.

[00:18:44] So it's really important when we're referring people and looking at resources that we are making sure for the people that we're telling to go here, that they are affirming. So we do our research as well. 

[00:18:58] Robin Rountree: Well, I have some letters to write to my government officials. Yeah. Please do, right? Please do. Yeah, 

[00:19:04] George Wallace: please.

[00:19:04] Robin Rountree: Oh my God. I had no idea. Okay. So we are gonna put some information in our show notes. Is there anybody else we need to know about to put in there? You've talked about SAGE. Any other organizations that you're like, nationwide they're a good place to contact? 

[00:19:22] George Wallace: So for centers, there's an organization called CenterLink.

[00:19:27] Oh. And CenterLink, um, you can go there and get a list of all of the resources and all of the centers that have specific programming, and you can go down and, for a senior program. So if you are living in Idaho or Ohio or California and you live within proximity of a center, you can reach out to them.

[00:19:48] We're all gonna be able to, to help in some small way, whether it's a referral or, you know, physical programs. We actually have hybrid programs, so some are online and some are in person, and we have lunch and learns, so yeah. 

[00:20:01] Robin Rountree: Amazing. Thank you. How about you? 

[00:20:03] Tee Rogers: Well, um, same on the professional side. Mm-hmm.

[00:20:06] There's a national organization called the NGLCC, and so if you're looking for a Pride Chamber of Commerce in your area, that's a wonderful place to start, and, um, get involved with the chamber. 

[00:20:17] Robin Rountree: Okay. Guys, thank you so much for this great information. And, tell me the website for the 

[00:20:24] George Wallace: center. Is thecenterorlando.org.

[00:20:26] Please make sure to subscribe to our podcast, Informed Aging, and tell your family and friends about us. You can find us at facebook.com/informedaging. Today's episode was recorded at ADRC's podcast studio. That's it for now. We're looking forward to our next visit 

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